Last week in the discussion we were trying to figure out who would and/or should bat second for the Padres in 2006. Reader Steve pointed us to a projected batting order at Padres.com, which shows Mike Cameron in the #2 hole.
A debate then ensued over whether Cameron strikes out too much to bat so high in the order. Lance Richardson eschewed the notion, claiming that “the worst thing a #2 hitter can do is ground into a double play.” Readers Anthony and Pat suggested some criteria for a #2 hitter, most notably the ability to get on base. Seems reasonable.
My own personal opinion is that everyone not named Brian Giles is best suited to hitting #6. Unfortunately this isn’t a viable option, so I looked around to see what others who had studied such matters might have to say.
First stop was Dan Agonistes, who notes that lineup construction is “one of those things that your intuition tells you must be one way when hard data shows something else.” Beyond stating the conundrum quite eloquently, he also points to a thorough evaluation of lineups (potential number overload warning) done by Tom Ruane at Retrosheet.
Ruane presents a great deal of data showing various scenarios and then concludes that, “If anything, my approach shows that batting orders matter even less than people have believed.” From this follows the assertion that, “Since all but the most pathologically weird lineups produce just about the same number of runs, I might be inclined to select the lineup that makes the most intuitive sense to the players and fans. Simply put, it’s not worth all the fuss you’d cause trying to be clever with lineups.”
Heady stuff. Potentially useful, but not terribly satisfying. Sure seems like lineup construction should matter, doesn’t it?
Well, let’s assume it does. Now what?
A funny thing happened over the weekend. I discovered this cool lineup analysis tool over at Baseball Musings.
I couldn’t resist. I grabbed my copy of Ron Shandler’s Baseball Forecaster and plugged his projections for the Padres starting eight (assuming Mark Bellhorn at second base) into the tool. I used actual 2005 figures (.180 OBP/.190 SLG) for the pitcher’s spot.
According to the numbers I fed into the tool, the Padres’ optimal lineup is as follows (please be seated for this part):
- Brian Giles, rf
- Mike Piazza, c
- Mark Bellhorn, 2b
- Mike Cameron, cf
- Ryan Klesko, 1b
- Khalil Greene, ss
- Vinny Castilla, 3b
- pitcher
- Dave Roberts, lf
Aside from the ghastly notion of batting Bellhorn third and the unconventional employment of the pitcher’s spot at #8, I’m struck by the idea of Piazza in the #2 hole. Although he gets on base at a decent clip (or did prior to 2005), Piazza also is one of the slowest players in all of baseball and a perpetual threat to ground into a double play.
Here is what the Padres.com article referenced earlier projects:
- Dave Roberts, lf
- Mike Cameron, cf
- Brian Giles, rf
- Mike Piazza, c
- Ryan Klesko, 1b
- Khalil Greene, ss
- Vinny Castilla, 3b
- Mark Bellhorn, 2b
- pitcher
The Baseball Musings Lineup Analysis tool shows the above lineup scoring 4.777 runs per game, which comes out to 774 runs for the season. Using the optimal configuration, the Padres score 4.997 runs per game, or 810 for the season. In other words, tweaking the lineup in a way that will make sense to no-one should net the Pads an additional 36 runs over the course of 162 games. In a tightly contested division, that could be the difference between making the playoffs and going home early.
It’s worth noting here that we’re still talking theory. Even if it made sense, nobody would use the “optimized” lineup because it looks so damn weird and is the kind of thing that could get a guy fired, or worse. That said, it’s fascinating stuff, and Dan Scotto has given some guidelines for characteristics of each spot in the lineup over at Beyond the Boxscore. Here is what Scotto says about the #2 hole:
The 2-hitter should be the lineup’s most balanced hitter, a good combination of OBP and SLG. David Wright fits the bill here, as does the player I chose, Chase Utley. The first guy I thought of was Mike Lowell in his prime, when I looked at the results and coefficients.
On the Padres, is that really Piazza? I’m not so sure. A better choice might be Klesko. If there is one skill of his that hasn’t deteriorated due to age and injury, it’s the ability to reach base.
Klesko also doesn’t ground into many double plays — just 14 in 1000 plate appearances over the past two seasons. The only guys in the projected lineup to get doubled up at a lower rate during that time are Bellhorn and, you guessed it, Cameron.
Again, I don’t see any real solid candidates for the #2 hole on this team. Klesko is probably my favorite option. But if you’ve already got lefties leading off and batting third, then it makes some sense to break that up with a right-handed hitter. And on a team devoid of traditional #2 type hitters, Cameron seems as good a choice as any to me.
Then again, maybe it doesn’t matter.
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