Guys You Wish You’d Forgotten Were Padres
Wed, Oct 24, 2007
by Geoff Young
We’re still safe here; hope you are, too. If you’re looking for info on the fires, ways to help, etc., check this thread. Otherwise, by request, here is a stupid follow-up to last week’s stupid post:
| Player | Year(s) |
|---|---|
| Shawn Abner | 1987-91 |
| George Arias | 1997-99 |
| Mark Bellhorn | 2006 |
| Sean Bergman | 1996-97 |
| Dewon Brazelton | 2006 |
| Chris Brown | 1987-88 |
| Sean Burroughs | 2002-05 |
| Vinny Castilla | 2006 |
| Jeff Cirillo | 2004 |
| Deivi Cruz | 2002 |
| Ben Davis | 1998-2001 |
| Glenn Dishman | 1995-96 |
| Dave Eiland | 1992-93 |
| Wiki Gonzalez | 1999-2003 |
| Luther Hackman | 2003 |
| Jack Howell | 1991 |
| LaMarr Hoyt | 1985-86 |
| D’Angelo Jimenez | 2001-02 |
| Bobby Jones | 2001-02 |
| Marc Kroon | 1995-98 |
| 1998 | |
| Derek Lilliquist | 1990-91 |
| Ray McDavid | 1994-95 |
| Donaldo Mendez | 2001-03 |
| Doug Mirabelli | 2006 |
| Keith Moreland | 1988 |
| Heath Murray | 1997-99 |
| Randy Myers | 1992, 1998 |
| Charles Nagy | 2003 |
| Kevin Nicholson | 2000 |
| Melvin Nieves | 1993-95 |
| Eddie Oropesa | 2004 |
| Methuselah Orosco | 2003 |
| Mike Pagliarulo | |
| Joe Randa | 2005 |
| Tim Redding | 2005 |
| Ruben Rivera | 1997-2000 |
| Kerry Robinson | 2004 |
| Stan Spencer | 1998-2000 |
| Dennis Tankersley | 2002-04 |
| Kerry Taylor | 1993-94 |
| Brian Williams | 1995 |
| Ed Wojna | 1985-87 |
Anyone we’re “missing”? Remember that some guys who might rub us the wrong way (Jim Leyritz) did make positive contributions to the team.
Winter Leagues
Seems obvious, but it bears repeating that winter-league stats represent an extremely small sample. Take them with the appropriate buckets of salt.
- Saguaros 9, Mesa 3 (box). Will Venable went 1-for-5 with a strikeout while batting cleanup and DH’ing.
- Culiacan 11, Mexicali 4 (box). Jared Wells gave up the game’s final three runs. Among other things, he walked ex-Padre Ruben Rivera (who went 1-for-3 and scored three runs) and struck out Pete LaForest (who finished 2-for-5 with 2 RBI). Benji Gil? Karim Garcia? Funny the names you see in winter ball.
- Estrellas 6, Escogido 5 (box). Vince Sinisi, batting third and DH’ing, went 3-for-4 with a walk.
- Navojoa 16, Obregon 5 (box). Looks like maybe the Mexican Pacific League has a mercy rule; this one went seven innings. Oscar Robles singled and walked in five trips to the plate. Luis Cruz, playing third base and moving up to #6 in the order, doubled in five at-bats.
- Caribes 10, Caracas 8 (box). Right-hander Paul Abraham came on to strike out the final batter in the ninth inning of his team’s loss.
Whoomp, there it is…
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October 24, 2007 at 7:40 am
I didn’t really mind Joe Randa, He did not have a great half season here but he plugged the hole that Burroughs created and the pads gave up Germano and Chick to get him.
October 24, 2007 at 7:42 am
also I would have put Darrell May on the list
October 24, 2007 at 8:24 am
Eddie Oropesa: When you absolutely must have a lefty in the pen, no matter how putrid.
I always liked Luther Hackman for one reason: In a game against the Giants, runners on, score was close and Barry Bonds was up. Hackman fell behind I think 1-0 or 2-1 and instead of throwing a couple of wide ones he pitched aggresively and got Bonds out. I was impressed with Bochy for not walking Bonds and with Hackman for having the testicular fortitude to go after him like that. Just one of those minor victories we used to savor when real victories were rare.
October 24, 2007 at 8:29 am
#3: Nice Hackman story. I omitted May from my list for a similar reason: his only victory as a Padre came against Johan Santana.
October 24, 2007 at 9:10 am
So is everyone rooting for the Rockies tonight? I hate to say it but I’m rooting for the redsox.
October 24, 2007 at 9:44 am
Pagliarulo, that stain, was a Padre and 89 and 90, not 84.
October 24, 2007 at 9:48 am
Steve…I am proudly wearing my sox gear today.
October 24, 2007 at 9:51 am
Go Red Sox
Go Matt Antonelli
October 24, 2007 at 9:52 am
Few glad to hear im not the only Sox fan here.
October 24, 2007 at 9:52 am
I always root against a division rival
October 24, 2007 at 9:59 am
If the Rockies win, we’re the only NL West team without a WS championship. But if the Red Sox win, they’re getting less distinguishable from the Yankees.
October 24, 2007 at 10:06 am
#6: Thanks, TW; not sure how I missed that.
#8: Thanks, Jack, for stopping by; best of luck to Matt!
October 24, 2007 at 10:18 am
#3: If you ever want to win a bar wager, bet on who the winning pitcher was in the first (regular season) game ever played at Petco Park.
Yep, none other than Eddie Oropesa, in 10 innings against the Giants.
October 24, 2007 at 10:19 am
Thank You Geoff
and thanks to everyone for their support of Matt.
October 24, 2007 at 10:43 am
In the Kerry Robinson category, I nominate Eugene Kingsale for the list.
October 24, 2007 at 10:55 am
#15: Kingsale wasn’t that bad. Of 53 outfielders with 200 or more career PA in a Padres uni, he ranks 30th in OPS+:
http://www.bb-ref.com/pi/shareit/VhTr
I should have included Stan Jefferson, though.
October 24, 2007 at 11:01 am
Ricky Stone?
October 24, 2007 at 11:05 am
Tom Lampkin?
October 24, 2007 at 11:07 am
Hi folks,
My first post … hold the applause please.
I would put Myers and Mirabelli at the top of the list. But here’s another for you: Ray Lankford!
Be safe everyone. Go Rockies!
Blessings!
JimD
-A long time Padre fan from the Commonwealth of Kentucky
October 24, 2007 at 11:17 am
#17, 18: I thought about Stone; is 32.2 IP enough? Lampkin is a good call; we could probably add Gary “2-0 Infield Popup” Bennett as well.
#19: Welcome, sir! Shockingly, Lankford ranks 28th on the list provided in #15. He was more productive than the very popular Eric Owens.
October 24, 2007 at 11:21 am
19, 20: I suspect that what makes many people so down on Lankford was that Woody went to St. Louis and threw the hell out of the ball.
October 24, 2007 at 11:23 am
#21: Yep. That trade still should have worked…
October 24, 2007 at 11:32 am
Re: 20 Brazelton only had 18, granted they were a terrible 18 but still only 18
October 24, 2007 at 11:42 am
#20: That is a bit surprising. I was more surprised to see Joe Carter way down in 44th (but at least he did have 115RBI).
#21: That’s probably a factor, but I never liked it from the start.
October 24, 2007 at 11:50 am
#23: Hmmm, good point. In my mind, he pitched a lot more than that. (The nightmares have finally subsided.)
October 24, 2007 at 12:47 pm
For us old time fans, Tom Phoebus should be on the list, one of the Padres early, bad trades, (Pat Dobson was traded, though we did get Enzo…)
October 24, 2007 at 12:48 pm
Former Padre Wes Gardner ! How could we forget Wes Gardner. For some reason I will always remember this Wes Gardner Save against LA in their home opener. http://www.baseball-reference&.....4120.shtml
He was out of baseball shortly thereafter.
October 24, 2007 at 1:04 pm
I’m definitely pulling for the Sox. I’ve gotten over my “How can the effing Rockies get to the WS when they’re only 15 years old as a franchise” phase by remembering the Padres were only 15 years old as a franchise in ‘84. However, I will not be a happy camper if the Rockies win a WS before us. The fact that the freaking Marlins have 2 just leaves me speechless.
October 24, 2007 at 1:05 pm
Want to know just how bad the Padres were in 1993 ? Examine the careers of guys like Kevin Higgins, Mark Ettles, or Tim Mauser.
October 24, 2007 at 1:13 pm
OT: Chargers are not talking about playing sundays game in Dallas.
October 24, 2007 at 1:25 pm
Ooops we are also missing the illustrious Dwain Anderson who put up a .121/.223/.121 line with 3 RBI in 107 at bats in 1973. In case you are thinking “good field, no hit” Dwain also contributed 9 errors in 39 games at SS for an illustrious .932 fielding percentage.
October 24, 2007 at 1:28 pm
No true baseball fan (unless you are currently living in New England) should be rooting for the Red Sox. There are many reasons for this but I will list a few:
1) The Rockies are simply a better story with 21 in their last 22 games, their 3 run comeback in the tie-breaker game (ack!), the first team since the 1976 Reds to win their first 7 playoff games.
2) The Rockies are built from their farm system rather than with expensive free agents. The Rockies have 16 home grown players on their roster and a payroll of $54m, the Red Sox have 4 players and a payroll of $143m.
3) If the Red Sox win the World Series, it will validate ESPN and Fox’s fixation on the Red Sox and Yankees to the detriment of all the other teams. Right now, for the networks, MLB consists of those two teams first and then all the rest of the teams are an afterthought. Other teams need to win to get the networks off this vicious cycle.
4) Finally, and most importantly, Red Sox fans (in fact most people from the New England area) are the most obnoxious fans out there. Another WS win would make those Mass-holes just that much more insufferable. There’s a reason that the Red Sox have become more hated then the Yankees recently and it’s not because they are successful (remember they missed the playoffs and finished behind the Blue Jays last season).
October 24, 2007 at 1:48 pm
Re: 32
1) Im still bitter
2) Redsox have a great farm system which gave them Kevin Youkilis, Dustin Pedroia, Jacoby Ellsbury and Jonathan Papelbon. Also they used thier farm system to trade for Josh Beckett, Mike Lowell, Jason Varitek, Coco Crisp, and Curt Schilling.
3) As much as we hate to admit it the Red Sox and Yankees games get the best raitings and thats what drives TV stations.
4) I like Red Sox fans, they can be obnoxious but its normaly as a Pro-Red Sox chant and not in a negative way to other teams like ::cough:: ::cought:: Yankees fans are.
I became a sox fan for the following reason.
1) Ted Williams
2) I love the city of Boston
3) You can’t go to a game at Fenway and not become a Red Sox fan.
4) I HATE the Yankees!
October 24, 2007 at 1:58 pm
32: I am not a baseball fan, I am a Padre fan.
I have only two sentiments that drive my baseball allegiances: pro-padres is #1 and anti-yankees a distant second.
go sox, boo rox
October 24, 2007 at 2:10 pm
No Padres fan should be pulling for the Rockies. If you do, you have a short memory.
The Rockies are in the playoffs because of a blown call — which no one in the media noticed, apparently — that kept the Padres out of the playoffs.
http://www.hollidaynevertouchedtheplate.com/
October 24, 2007 at 2:17 pm
35: I disagree. I “hate” the Sox as much as the Yanks now.
October 24, 2007 at 2:19 pm
What other MLB teams apparel does everyone else have in your closet other than Padres.
I have some Red Sox gear and a throwback Willie McCovey jersey.
October 24, 2007 at 2:22 pm
32: Completely agree. If I’m gonna root for any team, it’s gonna be the team that beat us. After all, the past two teams that have ended the Padres’ season has ended up in the World Series. Makes the wound a little bit less painful when you remember that.
If ya gotta get beat, get beat by the best.
And yeah, Sox fans are the worst ever. Maybe worse than Cubs fans.
Maybe.
October 24, 2007 at 2:27 pm
The team that beats the Padres is their enemy. Your enemy’s enemy is your friend.
October 24, 2007 at 2:27 pm
Steve C: with regards to point 3 the question is whether the ratings for Yankees-Red Sox is mainly because that’s all that the networks and MLB promote or because there is that much interest by the casual fans in those two teams. It’s kind of a chicken or the egg argument. Personally I believe that it’s the nonstop promotion of the two teams that drives the ratings, but I could be wrong.
Why root for any big-market team? So much of the backlash against the Yankees has been because of the perception that they’ve been buying their playoff spots. Why are the Red Sox any different? Luckily for both teams both GMs are just marginally competent (Cashman has been holding the Yankees back for years and Theo couldn’t even put together a playoff team with the #2 payroll in baseball last season).
As a Padres fan I always root for the NL team over the AL team (unless it’s the Angels) — except for maybe the Dodgers although I did root for them in the 1988. I don’t see why we should hate the Rockies — they are a .500 team that got incredibly lucky down the stretch. Plus if the Rockies sweep the Red Sox, the Padres can say that they were the only team to “beat” or at least give them a good game in the postseason.
Finally, regarding Holliday never touching the plate — I think we can agree that he was out at the plate. But there would’ve still been a runner on 2nd with two outs, Hawpe up and the pitcher’s spot coming up next. I’d assume they’d walk Hawpe so I have no idea who would come up next but what do you think the odds are that the next batter would have gotten a hit off Hoffman? With the way he was pitching, I’d say pretty good. Plus, at worst the game would’ve been tied, and the home team has a huge advantage in that situation. At best, the Padres had a 25% chance of winning that game. Better than zero chance that they had because of the blown call, but the odds were that they were still going to lose that game.
October 24, 2007 at 2:28 pm
If you watch the play again, Hawpe had not advanced to second. He would have been on first.
Man on first. Two outs. Hoffman on the mound. You can assume the worst if you want, but I don’t. The Padres should be in the series, as far as I’m concerned.
October 24, 2007 at 2:37 pm
Re: 40 The Yankees and Red Sox are big draws for three reasons:
1. History of success, casual fans like to watch winners.
2. Star Players, casual fans like to watch players who they know a little about.
3. Markets, New York is the largest media market and the New England Market is not far behind, so they are pulling from a larger Avid fan base as well as the casual one.
You can still argue the chicken and the egg with my first 2 arguments but both teams were successful and had their biggest stars before payrolls were an issue.
October 24, 2007 at 2:48 pm
I agree that the NY and NE are the biggest media markets in the country but that still leaves about 85% of the country that don’t live there. My main argument is that MLB is hurting themselves in the long run by focusing so much on the Yankees and Red Sox. Focusing on them is good in the short-term but probably not good for the long-term growth of the game. Not much of a shocker that Bud and the owners are looking short-term but par for the course for them.
October 24, 2007 at 2:55 pm
Re: 43 it has worked since they have started to put games on TV. Its more than just markets its about success and Star Power as well. When the teams are in down years (like the 80’s for the Yankees and the 90’s for the sox) they were not on TV nearly as much as they are now.
When the Big Red Machine was around they got a ton of air time because they had star players and were successful there fore the average fan was intrigued. Same as 90’s Braves and most other star filled teams.
October 24, 2007 at 3:00 pm
Chris Brown has gotta be the worst of the bunch.
Anyone know who our six year minor league free agents are this year?
October 24, 2007 at 3:10 pm
Re: 45 I forget does the year you are drafted count as a year?
October 24, 2007 at 3:15 pm
46 - I’m not sure, but this is about the time that the list is usually circulating around.
October 24, 2007 at 3:47 pm
I love the Sox, they’re probably my fave AL team, that said I’m rooting for the Rox for a lot of the same reasons Schlom said…
1. Less expensive team than Padres
2. A Rox WS win would help validate NL West
3. If the Rox win the “Holliday still hasn’t touched home plate” t-shirt (GY, do I get credit for sales boost?) will be that much more significant…
October 24, 2007 at 3:52 pm
Steve C
I’m with you man, rooting for the Sox. Boston is a great city and they’re my #2 team anyway.
I’m still a little sour about the Rockies as well, though there’s no one on the team I really dislike.
Because I’m in CT, the likelihood that my kids are going to grow up Padre fans is pretty remote. So as long as they follow one rule, they’re OK: No Yankee fans.
45
Not to talk bad about the deceased or anything, but didn’t C Brown sit out a game one time because of a bruised eyelash or something?
October 24, 2007 at 4:13 pm
41 … should say “If you watch the play again, Helton had not advanced to second. He would have been on first”
35 … re: “no one in the media noticed” … here’s 2 counter-examples …
http://sports.espn.go.com/broa.....id=3071027
http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/ne.....;type=lgns … “Holliday’s chin bounced off the ground, leaving a scrape that today continues to heal. His hand, sealed off by Barrett’s leg, never touched the plate. And yet home plate umpire Tim McClelland called him safe.”
October 24, 2007 at 4:15 pm
Go Rox … I’ll root for any non-Dodger/Met NL team in the WS … unless the A’s are playing for the AL … besides, how can be a Padre fan and not root for the underdog?
October 24, 2007 at 5:30 pm
50: Yes, I saw the “PTI” video on http://www.hollidaynevertouchedtheplate.com/
I linked to the Yahoo! article from my site.
My point is it was largely unnoticed by commentators, especially on ESPN, and columnists. The talking heads on ESPN just say it’s “inconclusive.”
Bullthrow.
October 24, 2007 at 5:33 pm
I don’t root for underdogs or overdogs. I root for teams based on how I personally like them. Right now, I would pull for the devil over the Rockies.
Also, who cares how much these teams spend. Yes, I realize the Padres don’t have a big budget. But other than the Padres’ budget, I don’t care who is a big market or small market team. I don’t see any of the money. J.D. Drew makes $11M a year. So what. He’s not giving me a cut.
October 24, 2007 at 5:46 pm
I think what Peter meant by that was if the Rockies win with a low payroll it gives the Padres hope to do the same.
October 24, 2007 at 7:20 pm
Here’s a few wish-we-forgot-about Padres - Kory Dehaan….Tim Hyers…Paul Faries…Jose Mota (I think he’s the color analyst in the stands on TBS now)
October 24, 2007 at 7:43 pm
Welcome to reality Rockies. I hope you lose. Best of 7 so you may win but again, I hope you lose.
October 24, 2007 at 7:57 pm
My justification for rooting for the Rockies is simple - they’re unstoppable (notwithstanding tonight’s current score).
Why should the Padres have had any better chance at stopping them then the Phillies, Diamondbacks or Red Sox? The other three at least had multiple chances, the Padres only had one.
Yes we got screwed on the call at the plate, but even if the call goes the other way, it doesn’t mean we win. And the Rockies didn’t blow the call, McClelland did. I can’t hate a team because the umpire blew a call they benefited from.
Re:42 “History of success” - the Red Sox hadn’t won the World Series in 88 years until 2004. That would appear to be a history of failure, not success!
If MLB/ESPN then started promoting them heavily, I’d be more inclined to buy that arguement.
The Yankees, on the other hand…
October 24, 2007 at 9:49 pm
Long time follower, but my first comment on the site. Great site Geoff!
Although Joey Hamilton did produce, wonder if he should be on this list?
October 24, 2007 at 10:07 pm
what about the recently released mike maroth as a 5th starter?
October 25, 2007 at 12:19 am
32: Yup, good points. Go Rox! Already the BoSox fans are insufferable, that based on their recent WS win. While, it will hurt to see the Rockies win WS before the Padres do, they are a better story and I don’t dislike their players as much as some of the Red Sox players.
Plus, officially they beat the Padres, and recently any team that beat the Padres in the playoff went on to win the WS. It’s much better than having to count how many ex-Padres on each team which was how I determined who’d win the WS for years. So, the next step up is for the Padres to win the WS. Yeah, I’m reaching here but heck, it’s baseball. Go NL! Go Rockies!
October 25, 2007 at 4:04 am
45 - to reply to myself, I found a listing of the 6 yr minor league FA’s:
Pitchers…
Paul Abraham
Mike Thompson
Aaron Rakers
Frank Brooks
Adrian Burnside
Scott Cassidy
Arturo Lopez
Edwin Moreno
Jon Searles
Steven Watkins
Catchers…
Brett Bonvechio
Todd Greene
Justin Hatcher
Infielders…
Luis Cruz
Jonathan Schemmel
Frank Menechino
Outfielders…
Hiram Bocachica
Yordany Ramirez
Royce Huffman
October 25, 2007 at 6:55 am
#26: Phoebus is a good call. Thanks!
#31: That is miserable. Not sure how I missed him.
#35: Beats rooting for the Red Sox.
#41: That is making a lot of assumptions. Truth is, it never should’ve come to a game 163, and I’m not talking about the Milwaukee meltdown. There were plenty of opportunities throughout the season to take care of business, and the Padres didn’t get it done.
#51: Yep. I’ll root for pretty much anyone but the Yankees, Red Sox, or Giants.
#58: Thanks, Al, for popping in! Hamilton is a tough call because he underperformed relative to expectations but still did a decent job. He contributed to the ‘98 squad, and by my count, he’s the 13th best starting pitcher in club history. Yes, I realize that is sad.
#59: Maroth doesn’t excite me at all, but he does seem like the kind of guy the Pads would put at the back end.
#61: Thanks, I’ve been looking all over for this. Usually BA puts out a comprehensive list and I scour it for potential bargains. Do you have a source?
October 25, 2007 at 8:00 am
62 (Maroth): Unfortunately true. He’d be another in the list of “Petco Fixer-Uppers,” an illustrious list that includes Darrell May, Tim Redding, Dewon Brazelton, and Chan Ho Park.
October 25, 2007 at 8:12 am
Hey what’s up guys? I really hope everyone is doing well with all the stuff that is going on here in town. Just got back from a week in San Francisco and a week in D.C. While I was gone I got to take a tour down to AT&T Park and got to drive around Camden Yards which was cool. Went to Philly to visit some of my wife’s family and got to listen to them bitch about how much they hate the Rockies. I really didn’t have much sympathy for them.
Any rumors or anything worth noting over the past 2 weeks that I have missed? I had my laptop with me but I didn’t even turn it on once so I have been out of the loop bigtime!
October 25, 2007 at 8:18 am
#63: Don’t forget Ismael Valdez (as if we could).
#64: Hey KRS1, welcome back and glad to hear you’re okay. You haven’t missed a lot on the Padres front.
October 25, 2007 at 8:21 am
65.
Thanks GY!
October 25, 2007 at 7:20 pm
62 - I posed the question on the SDUT board and got the answer. Not sure of the source, but here’s the link to that:
http://forum.signonsandiego.co.....hp?t=79570
October 26, 2007 at 12:35 pm
Wow, Eddie Oropesa. That guy seriously walked every batter he faced, and he had that really odd delivery where he turned his back to the hitter. He sucked.
Who can forget about:
Marty McCleary (2004)
Jason Shiell (2002)
Eric Cyr (2002)
Randy Williams (2005)
Aaron Rakers (2007)
Brandon Puffer (2004)
Jason Szuminski (2004)