In-Game Discussion: Padres vs Mariners (26 Jun 2005)
Sun, Jun 26, 2005
by Geoff Young
first pitch: 1:05 p.m., PT
television: Channel 4
matchup: Woody Williams (3-5, 4.13 ERA) vs Joel Pineiro (2-4, 5.57 ERA)
previews: ESPN | CBS | Padres.com
I was running around town yesterday so I only got to listen to Saturday’s 8-5 victory over the Rainiers on the car radio. Now that I’ve seen highlights on TV, I have three thoughts (which is three more than I usually have):
- Those throwback unis the Pads wore are sweet. I wouldn’t mind seeing the guys bust those out again sometime.
- How in the heck did Xavier Nady hit that pitch out to left field? How did he hit it out, period?
- After so many no-decisions earlier in the season, it was good to see Jake Peavy get a little help from his offense. Peavy didn’t have his best stuff yesterday but thanks to homers from Nady, Khalil Greene, and Mark Sweeney, and a two-run double (to right no less) off the bat of Sean Burroughs, the Padres ace was able to pick up the W.
Also, I got to wondering if Peavy’s struggles might have been related in some way to the high pitch count of his previous start, but the available evidence doesn’t really support that theory. Here are all the starts in which Peavy has thrown 120+ pitches (white), followed by his subsequent start (grey):
| Date | Opp | IP | H | R | ER | HR | BB | SO | Pit |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| 5/11/03 | @NYN | 6.1 | 7 | 2 | 2 | 1 | 5 | 6 | 128 |
| 5/16/03 | Atl | 6 | 7 | 4 | 4 | 2 | 2 | 5 | 110 |
| 9/7/04 | StL | 5.1 | 8 | 4 | 3 | 0 | 3 | 8 | 124 |
| 9/12/04 | @Col | 8 | 7 | 2 | 1 | 1 | 1 | 8 | 98 |
| 9/17/04 | @SF | 7 | 8 | 4 | 4 | 1 | 3 | 7 | 121 |
| 9/22/04 | LA | 8 | 3 | 2 | 2 | 0 | 1 | 11 | 114 |
| 6/20/05 | LA | 8 | 2 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 1 | 13 | 124 |
| 6/25/05 | Sea | 5 | 7 | 5 | 5 | 1 | 2 | 3 | 102 |
I still would prefer not to see a whole lot of those starts. OTOH, when you consider that only 4 of his 91 career starts falls into that category, it’s not so bad.
Sunday afternoon marks the finale of interleague play (remind me again why they do this now?). Two veteran right-handers go at it:
AB BA OBP SLG
Williams vs current Mariners 150 .253 .341 .427
Pineiro vs current Padres 58 .224 .250 .328
I will be out at today’s affair. Enjoy the game, and let’s take the series!
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June 26, 2005 at 11:52 am
More on Nady playing time. Geoff did an analysis of Nady as a starter vs. bench player. That got me thinking: what about him getting regular playing time vs. being “rusty”. This led me to categorize his AB’s into four categories: regular vs. rusty and bench vs. starter.
To set the criteria of “regular” I initially said, “3 games in a week”. These initial results were a bit surprising:
Starter, Regular (SReg)
Games: 20; AB: 75; OPS: .763
Starter, Rusty (SRust)
Games: 12; AB: 38; OPS: .886
Bench, Regular (BReg)
Games: 6, AB: 8; OPS: 1.150
Bench, Rusty (BRust)
Games: 11, AB: 13, OPS: 1.005
Regular: G: 26, AB: 83, OPS: .802
Rusty: G: 23, AB: 51, OPS: .917
Hmmm. Looks like Nady does best with rest, and is an especially good bench player.
I then expanded the criteria to be 4 games in a week.
SReg: G: 16; AB: 61; OPS: .901
SRust: G: 16; AB: 52; OPS: .695
BReg: G: 3; AB: 2; OPS: .333
BRust: G: 14; AB: 19; OPS: 1.139
I pushed it up to 5, and nubers even skew more towards Nady being a starter, but that is most likely an artifact of reducting the sample. To deal with the start of the season and latest AB (where I could not look back or forward to see his playing time to determine the “week”) I counted all the games in Colorado at the start of the season as a regular, and counted the latest two starts as a regular (with both Nevin and Roberts hurt that has to be the case). Sadly, outside those two cases, there are not enough games where he got 5+ starts in a week.
So he does well as a rusty bench player, but you do see some noticeable splits between his “regular” starts (OPS: .901) vs. “rusty” (OPS: .695), using the 4 games a week criteria. Play him regularly, and he plays better. If .900 OPS is his “regular starter” OPS, he becomes the best hitter on the team.
June 26, 2005 at 1:13 pm
Nice top of the first inning. Living in SF, I get almost all my games via MLB Extra Innings, which does not include Cox, but does include Fox. Apparently Fox is on the Nady bandwagon; when showing our defensive set up, they showed Nady in left and center; they also showed Loretta at second. Wishful thinking.
I like Williams start. Just bringing fastballs. The fouls got some pitches off his arm, but he was not going to walk anyone or try to get too deep in counts.
June 26, 2005 at 1:24 pm
Looks like I am chatting by myself. Normally I watch the games after they are over (via Tivo) but am watching it only slightly delayed. Damian. Nice jack. 3 outs followed, but Sweeney, Klesko and Giles all swung at strikes, went reasonably deep in the count, so OK AB’s.
June 26, 2005 at 1:26 pm
For some reason I really like this lineup
June 26, 2005 at 1:34 pm
I’m here. Kind of listening to game in and out.
June 26, 2005 at 2:01 pm
I’m here for a few minutes … I got a 421 tee time @ Torrey Pines North … lookin’ forward to it …
Here’s pitching #s thru 3.5 …
Pitches-strikes - J Pineiro 55-38; W Williams 62-38.
Ground balls-fly balls - J Pineiro 5-3; W Williams 3-6.
Batters faced - J Pineiro 13; W Williams 14.
June 26, 2005 at 2:04 pm
I gotta whine about Bochy still putting Burroughs ahead of Nady in the lineup … whassup with that? There’s just no reason … there’s barely reason for Burroughs to be in the lineup at all!
June 26, 2005 at 2:04 pm
Reed makes good catch on weak flair bat of Burroughs … the guy can’t even get lucky!
June 26, 2005 at 2:05 pm
That was smoked by X
June 26, 2005 at 2:05 pm
Nady just hit the f’n building. Wow!
June 26, 2005 at 2:05 pm
Nady … DONG … DONG … DONG …DONG … DONG … DONG …DONG … DONG … DONG …DONG … DONG … DONG …DONG … DONG … DONG …DONG … DONG … DONG …DONG … DONG … DONG …DONG … DONG … DONG …DONG … DONG … DONG …DONG … DONG … DONG …DONG … DONG … DONG …
into the upper level of the WMS building ….
June 26, 2005 at 2:08 pm
M’s score … Boone with shot to LF …
June 26, 2005 at 2:17 pm
What’s with DJ? 3 for 3 with a home run.
June 26, 2005 at 2:18 pm
Nady’s only the third player to hit a ball into the top shelf of the Western Metal Supply Co. Building (Khalil hit two and Miguel Cabrera one).
June 26, 2005 at 2:19 pm
Why not let Mark Sweeney swing the bat?
June 26, 2005 at 2:19 pm
Wow. That was an amazing play by Boone.
June 26, 2005 at 2:20 pm
Boone starts highlight-reel 4-6-3 DP
June 26, 2005 at 2:20 pm
That was completely sick by Boone. Jeez.
June 26, 2005 at 2:21 pm
He’s one of the top 20 defensive second baseman of all time…
June 26, 2005 at 2:23 pm
Williams: 5.0 IP, 3 H, 1 R, 0 BB, 5 K, 1 HR (77 Pitches, 49 Strikes)
Piņeiro: 5.0 IP, 7 H, 4 R, 0 BB, 2 K, 2 HR (88 Pitches, 60 Strikes)
June 26, 2005 at 2:24 pm
No walks today…
June 26, 2005 at 2:24 pm
Is he really?
June 26, 2005 at 2:25 pm
Padre hitters today: .350/.333/.700
June 26, 2005 at 2:26 pm
The Fox guys were saying some scouts think he’s the best. He ain’t.
June 26, 2005 at 2:26 pm
I’ll second it … perhaps Top 10 …
June 26, 2005 at 2:27 pm
that play by boone is the reason why the Padres wanted sweeney to bunt. second and third with one out means ground ball or long fly out scores a run, which is moot after the doubleplay.
June 26, 2005 at 2:27 pm
Kevin … what’s your concern? Who’s better defensively?
June 26, 2005 at 2:27 pm
In Bill James’ Win Shares, he rates everyone defensively and gives Boone a B-. That would not put him in the top 20. I don’t think it would be him anywhere near it.
June 26, 2005 at 2:28 pm
Sorry I havent posted more but I hate to come in here and start bubbling all over the page. I am feeling really good since the Padres started getting some offense going..
June 26, 2005 at 2:29 pm
That’s for career. I based the top 20 comment on a players’ best five consecutive years. Mazeroski was the best…
June 26, 2005 at 2:31 pm
Boone’s in the top ten that I’ve found the numbers for, but I feel like I’m probably missing a few.
June 26, 2005 at 2:31 pm
all this talk about Young coming back and taking over at 2nd prolly has gotten DJ a little scared for his spot on the roster. I think he is making a statement today…
June 26, 2005 at 2:32 pm
Right, that is for career. But Boone’s best five year’s were that great, I don’t think. Maybe they were. Joe Morgan used to gush over him, but I didn’t buy it. Of just the post-War second baseman, 21 received A’s from James. That’s not even counting the B+’s and B’s.
June 26, 2005 at 2:33 pm
Joe Morgan was better than Boone, too.
June 26, 2005 at 2:34 pm
I was also using Fielding Runs Above Average, not Fielding Win Shares.
June 26, 2005 at 2:35 pm
According to BP, the Wild Card now projects to require more wins than the NL West…
June 26, 2005 at 2:37 pm
Morgan gets a C from James. But I didn’t see him that much.
June 26, 2005 at 2:39 pm
Without Boone this game is a rout
June 26, 2005 at 2:39 pm
Agreed.
June 26, 2005 at 2:41 pm
Good thing we let Woody finish the seventh.
June 26, 2005 at 2:41 pm
Rivera with 3-run shot … tie game … 4-4
June 26, 2005 at 2:42 pm
That was Woody’s 103rd pitch …
June 26, 2005 at 2:43 pm
I dont believe Woody hung a curve to that kid. Geesh.. He is far too experienced to pull something like that, especially after the way he has handled the kid today.
June 26, 2005 at 2:43 pm
From Marc at BtB: http://www.beyondtheboxscore.c.....112111/560
June 26, 2005 at 2:46 pm
Would anyone here have pulled Woody? I know I wouldn’t have… Just damn.
June 26, 2005 at 2:50 pm
Yeah, I agree with what that guy said. Boone was celebrated as a great defender in Cincinnati, and that was a litte out of whack. And there’s no way he can be as good now, because of age.
Plus, it’s nice that that guy listed HOF second baseman, but many of the best are not Hall of Famers. For example, Frank White is one of the top five or so.
Here are the post-War guys James list as “A” fielders: Jerry Adair, Bobby Avila, Marty Barrett, Scott Fletcher, Nellie Fox, Bobby Grich, Glenn Hubbard, Bobby Knoop, Mike Lansing, Mark Lemke, Jose Lind, Bill Mazeroski, Jody Reed, Jackie Robinson, Red Schoendienst, Ted Sizemore, Rennie Stennett, Snuffy Stirnweiss, Manny Trillo, Fernando Vina, Frank White, Rob Wilfong.
June 26, 2005 at 2:53 pm
I’ve never been too big of a fan of Win Shares when comparing players from different seasons…
June 26, 2005 at 2:54 pm
Really, I thought that was supposed to be the strength of Win Shares?
June 26, 2005 at 2:54 pm
They’re not really going to blow this game… Are they?
June 26, 2005 at 2:59 pm
Nady can pick it too!
June 26, 2005 at 3:03 pm
Damian?
June 26, 2005 at 3:03 pm
I guess Jackson is a decent lead-off guy today.
June 26, 2005 at 3:04 pm
He is having a passable day
June 26, 2005 at 3:09 pm
Mariners announcer Dave Henderson: “With 413 saves, you an aura.” That hit me as profound.
June 26, 2005 at 3:09 pm
Dammit, “With 413 saves, you get an aura.” I hate when that happens.
June 26, 2005 at 3:10 pm
That Reed guy is insane.
June 26, 2005 at 3:12 pm
They have Ichiro on the bench
June 26, 2005 at 3:16 pm
Double play (Death and taxes).
June 26, 2005 at 3:17 pm
Nady putout, three outs (Hoffman).
June 26, 2005 at 3:22 pm
A’s 16 SF 0 — One Hitter. Ouch.