A Little Execution Never Killed Anyone
Wed, Jun 25, 2008
by Geoff Young
It’s the eighth inning of a 1-1 tie. You have runners at first and second, nobody out. The batter chases a 2-1 pitch at the ankles on a bunt attempt. You don’t score. You proceed to give up two solo shots in the top of the ninth and then go down without so much as a whimper in the bottom half.
That is terrible baseball. What’s to analyze?
Picking up where last year's version left off, the Ducksnorts 2008 Baseball Annual provides in-depth analysis of and commentary on the San Diego Padres. Get your copy today.
June 25, 2008 at 7:47 am
You are right, nothing to analyze. So, anyone else check out those red, white and blue caps the teams will be wearing?
June 25, 2008 at 7:49 am
Interesting “Related Posts” Geoff…I am not one to usually notice those things, but it is a little macabre, dontcha think?
June 25, 2008 at 7:54 am
Did anyone else think it was dumb to try to have Gerut bunt there in the first place? The guy hadn’t had a sacrifice since 2005. Now I realize that he’s a MFL (hat tip to Ted William and Jim Bouton in Ball Four) ballplayer, but the worst that could have happened in that situation was a GIDP. Jody hits the ball pretty damn hard, and I would have felt a little more comfortable letting him swing away.
Then again, hindsight is 20/20. I’m pretty sure that as I was watching the AB, that I was wondering to myself what the hell Buddy was thinking. Unfortunately, I’ve wondered that all too often this year.
June 25, 2008 at 7:54 am
Posts with “killed” in the title might do that. Damn emotionless computers!
June 25, 2008 at 8:05 am
A: Bunting is a learnable skill; every player should be capable of laying down a bunt.
B: Asking a guy who can’t bunt to do so is throwing away an at bat.
C: Everyone knew a bunt was coming so why not pinch hit with the one guy on the team who can bunt, Greg Maddux?
Nevermind that they never would have been in that situation if they could have scored more than one run off Slowey. Yet another pitcher sets a season high strikeout mark against the Padres.
On the positive side, both Slowey an Nathan are on my fantasy team. Thanks Pads!
June 25, 2008 at 8:09 am
3. That was my thought at the time. I liked the choice to use Stansberry for a sac bunt — reducing the risk of a Tony Clark twin killing - but Gerut gets down the line pretty fast and a single (probably) puts us ahead. And a force play at third with the catcher running is not a gimme sacrifice either.
Given that, even if successful, it’s no guarrantee the run comes in without a hit (~70%? A bit less for the Padres perhaps?), I don’t think it was worth giving up the out. Then again, a strikeout wasn’t so hot either.
June 25, 2008 at 8:19 am
It is time for the FO to stop hemming and hawing about weather they are buyers, or sellers and find the best possible deals for: Maddux, Wolf and Giles.
June 25, 2008 at 8:23 am
Turning away from the game, which is not fun the next morning on MLBTV…..the Mets are said to be considering a demotion of Ollie Perez. He’s not having the kind of season you’d want before free agency. Should the Padres consider trading for him now in order to get a start on negotiations? When he was traded to Pittsburgh he said he’d love to come back to the Padres someday. He could be reunited with Balsley, who coached him in the minors.
We don’t have that many trading chips, and I’m not sure how much extra credit we’d get for freeing him from NY. But it might be worth thinking about.
June 25, 2008 at 8:28 am
#2@Coronado Mike: Yeah, I guess it is.
June 25, 2008 at 8:29 am
#8@Tom Waits: It’s not a horrible idea, IMO. He could be a serviceable fifth starter. I’d be in favor of slotting him there until he showed some promise.
Do the Mets really expect to get much back for him? He’s about to be a FA and he’s not exactly setting the world on fire. Wouldn’t a decent minor league arm do it?
June 25, 2008 at 8:32 am
#9@Geoff Young: Not noticing any difference without avatars.
June 25, 2008 at 8:42 am
#10@Phantom: The Mets don’t have that much incentive to move him, though. If they’re looking to the playoffs he’s a pitcher who can possibly give you 12-15 strikeouts in a game. Nobody else on their staff has the same potential to dominate. Not even Pedro, anymore. I think they’d be looking for immediate major league help back.
June 25, 2008 at 8:44 am
I’m thinking Trevor doesn’t an extension when his contract expires this year. Brutal!
June 25, 2008 at 8:48 am
#13@LaMar: If the booing was directed at him and not the overall play of the team….poor caddying.
June 25, 2008 at 8:50 am
The failed bunt attempts was when I first noticed the booing.
The frustration of witnessing basic fundamentals being executed so poorly, flowed over into the ninth inning back to back HRs.
The game fell apart for the Padres very quickly.
It was a terrible 8th and 9th inning.
June 25, 2008 at 8:53 am
#12@Tom Waits: True, but I would think that if they’re considering demoting him, that perhaps their opinions have sourfed enough that they would be happy to get anything back. Could we do it for like a Clay Henlsey type?
June 25, 2008 at 9:01 am
#16@Phantom: I think the demotion is to the pen, not to the minors. If he’s still a Met he can contribute - nasty LOOGY, spot starter, possibly dominant in the stretch run. They have to balance living with him another 3 months, with the good and bad that can bring, with what they’d get in trade. Unless they’re getting an arm to replace him, from us or someone, I don’t see it happening.
If their minor league system hadn’t been so stripped for Santana, maybe we could have built something around Wolf + Giles (to replace Alou) for Heilman, Perez, and a top prospect. They seem likely to hold onto Fernando Martinez.
June 25, 2008 at 9:01 am
I’m sorry but I need to get something off my chest. I red that opening article on the SDUT and the snide and self-righteous remarks by Clark, Estes, Peavy and everyone else about the fans booing trevor. I wasn’t at the game but I was booing just the same at home. And the UT is full of comments about how we are wrong for booing, how we forget what a great guy trevor is etc.
Personally speaking to everyone who commented in that article; **** you. With the exception of A-Gon not one of them has done a damn thing all year. You all deserve to be booed, and that includes Trevor Hoffman who’s having one of his worst years in a long time. Do not be snide with us, those dumb fans who pay your salary from our harder earned salary, because we are watching you all fail to execute, fail to play and obviously not give a rat’s ***.
What you mentioned Geoff, that’s on the players who have CONSISTENTLY been incapable of getting anything done and even more so on the coaches who are both not teaching their players and not punishing them for their mistakes. We have a milktoast team with a pathetic excuse of a leader which needs to be blown up.
June 25, 2008 at 9:02 am
7. Why trade Giles? He’s signed to a fair contract for next year, and good corner outfielders are not as easy to find as people think.
June 25, 2008 at 9:06 am
#19@Mike Champion: Yeah, OG is not the easiest decision to make. He’s been productive and his option next year is not onerous. It all depends on what you get back for him and how confident you are that the 2009 Padres will be improved enough to compete.
June 25, 2008 at 9:06 am
#18: So, how ARE you feeling about the team’s play thus far?
June 25, 2008 at 9:06 am
#12 Tom Waits, you don’t think Johan Santana has the potential to dominate?
June 25, 2008 at 9:07 am
#3@Phantom: #5@Anthony: I initially thought that it would be a better idea to send Maddux up to bunt, instead of Stansberry, who looked like he had never been asked to bunt in his life. But by batting Stansberry, there was a bit more flexibility (hit-and-run or swing away once the bunt wasn’t executed), and it worked out.
But I absolutely hated the idea of having the hottest hitter on the team bunt with runners on 1st and 2nd and nobody out. I think all of us who follow the team on a daily basis realize that this particluar team is not very good at playing for one run. Wouldn’t the manager know that better than anyone? This team is not much for execution. Even if he gets the bunt down, the Pads have not been very good with a runner at third and less than two outs. So why not let Jody swing away? He doesn’t hit into many DP’s. Terrible call by Black. Plus, the reliever was all over the place. Why not give Gerut the take sign after he didn’t come close on the first two pitches? Geez, what an awful way to lose a game.
June 25, 2008 at 9:08 am
#22@Gus: Geez, total brain fart. Apologies.
June 25, 2008 at 9:11 am
#24@Tom Waits: Dang, that synonym for “toot” is filtered.
June 25, 2008 at 9:12 am
#23@JMAR: I think you articulate this beautifully. I totally and completely agree.
On the whole fans booing thing:
I think it’s classless to boo a failure to perform. You can boo players for being dicks, for being classless, or for not hustling. But in a sport that lauds players who have successful at-bats only 30% of the time, booing a player’s performance seems somewhat hypocrticial.
June 25, 2008 at 9:20 am
#14@Tom Waits: It was not a good night for Padre fans at Petco, between the booing of the second or third best player in franchise history and the wave getting more attention than the game in the seventh as the Padres were tying the score.
June 25, 2008 at 9:21 am
#26@Phantom: Especially the “lack of effort” part. Only the most brazen cadillacing can be detected from the stands (or TV). Hoffman made two bad pitches and his margin for error is almost nonexistent these days. Today he’ll go through the same rigorous workout he’s undertaken for almost 15 years. No lack of effort, possibly just a lack of the same ability. It happens to everyone, and it’s nothing to be booed.
I don’t see that any current Padre suffers from a lack of effort or heart. Even if they did nobody here is qualified to diagnose it.
June 25, 2008 at 9:21 am
#26@Phantom: I am not much of a boo’er. Maybe 2-3 times I have ever done so, but I will leave judgement of etiquette to Miss Manners.
Booing doesnt happen in a vacuum. I think it is a culmination of many failures this season along with the deception we have been served by the FO.
June 25, 2008 at 9:25 am
#18@Loren: There is a mammoth gulf between failure to execute and not caring, and I do not understand automatically linking the two. For my money, the only reason you Boo the home team, is lack of effort. I don’t see much point in Booing a pitcher, because he failed to locate a fastball.
June 25, 2008 at 9:26 am
How often should a batter take the first pitch?
I understand the value of a patient approach at the plate … getting a starting pitcher’s pitch count up … waiting for a mistake … drawing walks …
But there is a limit, right? If a batter takes too many first pitches, then he’ll too often be down in the count 0-1.
That seemed to happen more than it should have last night …
Once Slowey proved he could and was going to throw strike one on the first pitch, it seems like the Padre hitters could have benefited by being more aggressive at the start of their ABs.
Here’s a link where you can see what happened, pitch-by-pitch …
http://www.sportsline.com/mlb/.....624_MIN@SD
June 25, 2008 at 9:29 am
#26@Phantom:
That’s pretty much what Jim Rome of all people said to lead off his show this morning.
June 25, 2008 at 9:35 am
#30@Field39: There were 2 fastballs in a row that were not located. There were also two attempts to bunt that were poorly executed. Again, it is not really my style to boo, but I think fans who pay $50-100/game are entitled to express their dissatisfaction.
June 25, 2008 at 9:45 am
#32@Stephen: Perhaps Rome should go to YouTube and watch his interview with Jim Everett.
Being lectured by Jim Rome about fan behavior, is like being lectured about ethics by Duke Cunningham.
Or being lectured about mental stability by Milton Bradley.
Or being….I got a thousand more, but I think you get the picture
June 25, 2008 at 9:55 am
Also, someone might want to tell Jody Gerut that he really is not a base stealer despite the fact that he feels obligated now that he is penciled daily into the leadoff spot.
June 25, 2008 at 9:58 am
About the booing.
I was at the game last night. In the 8th inning at least, I, along with most of the people around me, were booing Bud Black when Gerut was trying to bunt. I think every other word I heard during Gerut’s at bat was idiot, or the like, but worse. And I was sitting around a lot of retiree/season-ticket holders.
For the 9th, it seemed like an overload of frustration with the entire game and season. Poor hitting with men on, poor managerial decisions, and a bullpen that has one of the worst ERAs in the league, etc.
On a different note, I was sitting just behind the Padres dugout (thanks for the tix!!!) and had a great view of the batter’s box. It is no wonder that Greene is having a tough time hitting this year. I have rarely seen any hitter move around so much in the box.
While the pitcher is getting ready, Greene is constantly shifting his weight between his front foot and back foot - about 2 shoulder widths apart. At the same time, he is waggling the bat and his top hand is squeezing and letting go of the bat. Visible from a good 60 feet.
As the pitcher comes set and starts his motion, Greene shifts his weight to his back foot, brings his front foot back to just apart one shoulder-width apart, cocks his bat and twists his trunk to his right while dropping his head slightly.
It doesn’t seem possible to be consistent with that much movement.
Lastly, can anyone understand the words in the 300 clip they play for Heath Bell.? Just play the theme music, that is stirring enough.
June 25, 2008 at 10:02 am
In my opinion, there are two guys that should be exempt from ever getting booed by Padre fans, Tony Gwynn and Trevor Hoffman. These are easily the two greatest Padres of all-time. First-ballot Hall-of-Famers who spent 15+ season with the team.
However, I highly doubt that yesterday’s boos were directed at Hoffman. Yes, he was on the mound and he gave up two mammoth homers, serving up BP fastball’s to the 7 and 8 hitters on the team with the least amount of homers in baseball. But, I’m guessing those fans were ready to boo whenever and however that game was lost, based on that brutal bottom of the 8th. That, and the fact that our team is 14 games under .500.
It’s silly for the players to come to Hoffman’s defense. Those boos are meant for the sorry performance of the entire team this season. Not just a few bad games from Hoffman.
June 25, 2008 at 10:05 am
#33@parlo: For their entertainment dollar the fans are guaranteed a contest, not a win. Perhaps they would of been satisfied, if following the second home run, Bud had gone out their and recreated the opening scene from “Branded.”
OT: Is anyone else having a problem with the preview function?
June 25, 2008 at 10:11 am
#38@Field39: Yes.
June 25, 2008 at 10:12 am
I think if you’re on a last-place team, 14 games under .500, 2nd-worst record in the NL, 3rd-worst record in MLB, you should EXPECT to get booed, not vice versa.
I mean, I am not the booing type at all, but what situation would merit it more? I certainly don’t get the sense that the Padres aren’t trying, but time and time again you see poor execution.
As a fan, if you want to boo the coaches or management but not the players, or if you want to boo the players and coaches but not management, it still sounds the same in the stadium. It sounds like boos, and that doesn’t mean the Padres don’t love Trevor, or think the guys aren’t trying. It means they think this team sucks, and I don’t blame them for it.
June 25, 2008 at 10:14 am
#38@Field39: Straw Man arguments always seem like an attempt to paint others with too wide a brush.
I dont know of any fan attending a game who ever believed they were guaranteed a victory.
June 25, 2008 at 10:18 am
#38@Field39: Yes to both your comment and the Preview question. Double points for the Chuck Connors reference.
Fans booing the bunt decision, that’s fine. Bunts are rarely a good call and Black seems, in an unscientific opinion, to have regressed in his game management this season.
Booing Hoffman, and justifying it by claiming they can tell he didn’t care, is dishonest and classless.
June 25, 2008 at 10:22 am
#28@Tom Waits:
I don’t see that any current Padre suffers from a lack of effort or heart. Even if they did nobody here is qualified to diagnose it.
Where does “underachieving” fall in the whole scheme of things? Does it relate to effort or heart?
June 25, 2008 at 10:30 am
#42@Tom Waits: Who is claiming that they booed because Hoffman “doesnt care” ????
June 25, 2008 at 10:30 am
#43@Jeremy: If a player is working hard and doing everything to put himself in a position to succeed, but isn’t, that’s either bad luck or a simple lack of skill or physical ability. I don’t see a reason to boo someone for those things.
IMO, fans tend to think player effort and heart matter more than they do because it mentally levels the playing field. For some fans, it’s a way of believing that there’s something that fan would do better on the field than the players themselves. Like, “If I had that much physical talent, there’s no way I’d go down swinging at 3 sliders.” Sure they would, if Brad Lidge was on that night.
June 25, 2008 at 10:32 am
#44@parlo:
Excerpts from Loren: You all deserve to be booed, and that includes Trevor Hoffman who’s having one of his worst years in a long time. Do not be snide with us, those dumb fans who pay your salary from our harder earned salary, because we are watching you all fail to execute, fail to play and obviously not give a rat’s ***.
Rat’s behind, not caring, seem to be the same thing to me.
June 25, 2008 at 10:38 am
#34@parlo:
Get over the Everett thing. That was, what, 12-15 years ago?
You didn’t listen, I take it, nor did I even try to get across his tone. It wasn’t lecturing. “If I was there in the stands, I’m not booing Trevor Hoffman. I understand paying the $ gives someone the right to boo. I understand the frustration. Hoffman is really struggling this year, but it wasn’t a case of dogging it, lack of effort etc.”
June 25, 2008 at 10:42 am
#46@Tom Waits: Oh yeah, I forgot about that post. HA! Nonetheless, trying to paint anyone who booed as being of similar mind seems like a stretch.
June 25, 2008 at 10:43 am
44;
Duly noted, I was on a rant
And I do believe you can be booed for a continual failure to perform including Hoffy. I love him, he’s a great player and I’ll love having him in cooperstown but he isn’t performing
June 25, 2008 at 10:44 am
#45@Tom Waits:
I can see your point. You hit on something very important here:
Like, “If I had that much physical talent, there’s no way I’d go down swinging at 3 sliders.”
That is the type of attitude or statement that has always been like fingernails on the chalkboard to me. Why again are we all sitting at home or the park watching and not on the field playing?…Exactly.
June 25, 2008 at 10:44 am
#47@Stephen: You are absolutely correct. I do not listen to talk radio of any kind.
June 25, 2008 at 10:45 am
Booing in San Diego. Great, the tranquil baseball town shows some passion……I am sure if you even asked Hoffman he would say that he would have been booing himself.
To boo or not to boo, a question or debate that would only take place in San Diego.
After all, what’s the big deal ?
June 25, 2008 at 10:54 am
#48@parlo:
It’s better that way. I have a short commute, so my exposure is limited. I do think the statute of limitations has passed on the Everett thing. Rome — on radio at least — isn’t nearly as bad as some make him out to be.
June 25, 2008 at 11:00 am
#48@parlo: Most posts about this topic seem to be “booing certain things makes sense, booing other things does not.” I don’t see anyone wielding a broad brush or a spray can.
#49@Loren: It’s your nickel. And I don’t know how long you’ve been watching the Padres. But 6 years from now I wouldn’t want to remember that in Hoffman’s 16th season in San Diego I gave him the business based on 5 to 10 appearances. I’d feel pretty rotten about myself. There have been years when Hoffman was one of only 2 or 3 players worth a darn on the whole squad. I’d feel pretty rotten if I booed a man with his record due to 1/3 of a season’s worth of poor performances.
June 25, 2008 at 11:05 am
#53@Stephen: Fair enough.
What I do want to clear up is my view of booing. I am not one to boo. I am more likely to commiserate with the fan sitting next to me, or come on a site such as this and express my displeasure.
What I disagree with, is the attempt to portray anyone who boos as some sort of mindless lout who knows nothing about the game.
If GY can complain on here that this is “terrible baseball”, I certainly dont see why the paying customers at the game cant voice their displeasure.
June 25, 2008 at 11:11 am
#55@parlo: No disagreement there. And I don’t read any of the posts here going the “mindless lout” route.
June 25, 2008 at 11:25 am
#56@Tom Waits: Perhaps Im being overly critical of these comments:
“Classless”, “hypocritical”, post #38, “If I had that much talent”, “brazen cadillacing”.
IMO, that portrays people who boo as rather boorish fans.
June 25, 2008 at 11:33 am
I dislike booing.
Is it constructive? Doubtful.
Would you do it if you were face to face with the person? Doubtful.
Do you feel you have some right because you are paying for the product?
It’s disrespectful to the person as a person, in my opinion. I can understand it happening — we all get emotionally wrapped up in rooting for our teams and we do things without thinking. I’m not pretending I’m a saint.
#55@parlo: But it is completely different than commentary or analysis in the paper or on a blog. It’s intended to make the other person feel bad. Let’s not pretend a “boo” is well thought constructive commentary or analysis. It’s an emotional outburst, sometimes meant to “get back” at the player for screwing up. Comparing it to a day after blog is a joke. The people doing it aren’t mindless louts, but the act itself is mindless.
But aside from general booing, booing Trevor is ridiculous. This is the SECOND GREATEST PADRE of all time. So he blows a few saves at 41. Get over yourself. 95% of the people booing haven’t accomplished half of what Trevor has, and 100% of them have contributed less to the Padres over the years. This day to day mentality is embarassing sometimes.
And if you were booing Black, well, again, if it is well thought out, you’d realize that “BOOOO” doesn’t really get that point across, does it?
June 25, 2008 at 11:49 am
#57@parlo: Those comments, to my mind, were directed specifically at people who boo because (they claim) they can tell the player is dogging it. I don’t think fans, except in the most extreme cases, can determine that a player is flat-out not trying. When people say they’re booing for Reason X, and they can’t possibly actually know that Reason X occurred, that’s what most of the posts here seem to have a problem with.
#58@Alan: I expect Black understood who those particular boos were directed at. There aren’t a lot of other options for expressing your displeasure with a decision. No instant voting buttons on your armrest. Nobody in the dugout is going to notice if you walk out.
June 25, 2008 at 11:52 am
I remember Yankee fans booing Mariano Rivera last season. Big deal. What did it mean ? Nothing.
It’s part of the game. Probably all that now sit in the Hall of Fame where booed at some time by the home town fans.
Only in San Diego would this be an issue.
June 25, 2008 at 11:54 am
#60@JP: How much do you want to bet I can find stories about the Mariano Rivera booing being unjustified and/or dumb? It’s not just an issue in San Diego. It was a story when Philly fans booed their team early this season.
June 25, 2008 at 11:55 am
I understand the players don’t like being booed, but is it really that big of a deal? Or are these players like Darryl Strawberry when he appeared on the Simpsons? (I looked for clip of that but couldn’t find it anywhere, I suspect that we could use some humor!)
However Black, Clark and Peavy should keep their mouth shut about complaining about it. If they are trying to get the fans to turn on the team, I think that’s the best way of doing it. I don’t think they are going to get much sympathy from anyone.
June 25, 2008 at 11:55 am
#58@Alan: I disagree. Using your rationale, only newspaper reporters and bloggers are allowed to voice frustration or any dissatisfaction. Fans at the game must suppress any emotion.
These are very well payed millionaires who are employed by an obscenely rich owner. They charge outrageous prices and demand subsidies from every taxpayer. They are given applause, and even parades when they succeed. I see no harm in a paying customer voicing displeasure when they witness what has taken place last night and this season.
June 25, 2008 at 11:56 am
#59@Tom Waits: I kind of like the buttons on the arm rest thing.
June 25, 2008 at 11:58 am
I remember as a young kid hearing Red’s fans booing Johnny Bench in their championship year of 1976. If you brought that to Bench’s attention now, what do you think his reaction would be ?
June 25, 2008 at 12:00 pm
#61@Tom Waits: Perhaps, but would you agree that the attention to such an issue is very short term. It’s part of the game !
June 25, 2008 at 12:04 pm
#65@JP: I don’t know, but I think it’s quite possible he would remember it, and not fondly.
#66@JP: The Padres-Twins game ended about 14 hours ago.
June 25, 2008 at 12:10 pm
For some perspective from Reds blogger :
I used to sit in the stands at Riverfront in the early 70’s and hear them boo Johnny Bench. I don’t think I’ve heard anyone booed as much a Bench was.
“Deadcat” comments on Ohio Sports Fan Blog (2007)
June 25, 2008 at 12:12 pm
#67@Tom Waits: Give it another 10 hours.
Bench would probably laugh it off and say that it is part of the game. You think he harbors any bitterness whatsoever about being booed ?
June 25, 2008 at 12:15 pm
#63@parlo: I really would like to understand what the size of the paycheck has to do with this discussion. Yes, they are well paid for a very specialized skill…why does that have ANYTHING to do with booing or not?
June 25, 2008 at 12:19 pm
#12@Tom Waits: No one else? I’ve heard that Johan Santana guy is pretty good.
June 25, 2008 at 12:20 pm
#68@JP: Bench also made some comments about the Vietnam War, which clouds the issue. Seaver did the same thing (”if the Mets can win the WS, then the US can certainly find a way to end the Vietnam War”). Right wingers attacked him for it, and Bench came to his defense.
June 25, 2008 at 12:23 pm
Personally, I would like to see Hoffman throw that pitch he threw to Harris to a real power hitter. Imagine if he threw that pitch to Albert Pujols, where would it have ended up? Off the scoreboard maybe?
Seriously, if A-Gon is in the Home Run Derby before the All-Star Game this year he should get Hoffman to be his pitcher. Throw some meatballs like he did last night and Adrian would win for sure!
June 25, 2008 at 12:23 pm
#70@Coronado Mike: If the fans and the taxpayers are the ones who pay the salaries, then I think they are entitled to express dissatisfaction.
June 25, 2008 at 12:26 pm
#73@Schlom: This is the sort of reactionary drivel that makes the arguement for the other side in this whole “booing” arguement. What Hoffman doesn’t deserve is this sort of ****.
June 25, 2008 at 12:29 pm
#72@parlo: This is interesting. I am a history fanatic so I find this tidbit worth investigating. I don’t think it had anything to do with Reds fans booing Bench though(.234 in ‘76).
June 25, 2008 at 12:29 pm
#74@parlo: I “pay” the salary of teachers, but I don’t walk around booing them for a bad performance…but you are right, they don’t make more than me, so that makes them safe.
I don’t know, I guess it is frustrating when salary is brought up…I really don’t see how what their income is or how much John Moores has in the bank has ANYTHING to do with the discussion of booing…
June 25, 2008 at 12:34 pm
#76@JP: No, certainly not in 1976.
This happened in 1969 -70 or so. It blew over. Within no time Bench was appearing on HeeHaw and doing his Krylon paint commercials. Like many outrages, it was short lived.
June 25, 2008 at 12:35 pm
#18@Loren: What the …?
“It’s disheartening, knowing what Trevor has meant not only to the organization but the city, and his level of accomplishment is unmatched in our game,” Clark said.
Snide? Self-righteous? I see nothing of the sort in Clark’s comment. Clearly you disagree with the sentiments of Peavy and Estes and have taken them to be snide and self-righteous, but I think you are completely off the mark with regards to Clark.
And you’re not personally speaking to anyone who commented in the article by posting in DS. Maybe it’s time to take a deep breath, step back from the cliff and realize the Padres are having a bad year but it’s not the end of the world.
June 25, 2008 at 12:36 pm
#71@Pat: You’re late to the party. Gus already mocked my vapor lack. I’ve poured ashes on my pate.
#69@JP: Neither one of us knows what Johnny Bench thinks about his booing, whether it bothered him when it happened, or how long it bothered him. I wouldn’t try to assign any probability to any particular reaction. It’s quite possible it didn’t bother him at all when it happened or afterwards, just as it’s quite possible that it stuck in his craw for a long time. There are some players who do remember it well after the event occurs. Besides, Bench in the early 70s was not Bench in 1982 or 1983, which is more analogous to Trevor’s situation. He’d been a great player by then, but 5-6 years with the same team doesn’t earn you same loyalty as 16 or 17. Not in my eyees, anyway.
#74@parlo: Fans aren’t paying the salaries, anymore than I’m paying the salary of an autoworker when I buy a car. I’m paying a price for a commodity or service. What the company who provides the commodity or service does with the money I pay them is their concern.
But I’m not anti-booing. It’s the “dishonest” booing that bugs me.
June 25, 2008 at 12:37 pm
#28@Tom Waits: Hear, hear!!!!!!
June 25, 2008 at 12:40 pm
I was saying Boo-urns.
June 25, 2008 at 12:40 pm
#77@Coronado Mike: If parents hold a rally to express their displeasure with a school district, do you get equally outraged ? Do you go on blogs and say that parents dont have a right to voice dissatisfaction ?
Just wondering,…. since you brought up the teacher scenario.
June 25, 2008 at 12:45 pm
#75@JP: Hey, I’m not blaming Hoffman, it’s not like he threw that meatball on purpose. I’m generally curious. The hardest hit ball I’ve ever seen was that home run McGwire hit off a Randy Johnson fastball in the Kingdome — that pitch by Hoffman probably wouldn’t have gone as far as it wasn’t thrown as hard but it might have been one of the “worst” (or best depending on your perspective) pitch I’ve ever seen. Seriously, how about Branyan? He hits monster shots, do you think the Park is out of range? Personally, I’d like to see that.
As far as the game goes, to me, a loss is a loss. Sure I’d rather see them win but do you think Trevor is going to dwell on those pitches he threw? I doubt it. Same with the booing. Sure it’s better to be not booed, but is it really that big of a deal? The only reason Trevor cares is because of what happened to lead to the booing, not the booing itself.
June 25, 2008 at 12:48 pm
#82@Hans Moleman: Thank you…that laugh was perfect.