Padres Pitcher Smackdown: Dravecky vs Kirby
Tue, Jan 30, 2007
by Geoff Young
Opinion was pretty divided on Day 1 of Padres Pitcher Smackdown, with Gaylord Perry and Dave Roberts each gaining their share of support. In case you missed it, each day this week we’re examing two starting pitchers and trying to determine which should rank higher in Padres history. Randy Jones isn’t on this list because he’s a clear #1.
Here is the schedule for the entire week:
- Monday: Gaylord Perry vs Dave Roberts
- Tuesday: Dave Dravecky vs Clay Kirby
- Wednesday: Bruce Hurst vs Jake Peavy
- Thursday: Andy Ashby vs Eric Show
- Friday: Andy Benes vs Ed Whitson
Today’s matchup features an underappreciated lefty, Dave Dravecky, and one of the original Padres, Clay Kirby.
To the numbers:
| Year(s) | GS | IP | ERA | ERA+ | WS | |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| Career with Padres | 1982-1987 | 119 | 900.1 | 3.12 | 115 | 57 |
| Best year with Padres | 1985 | 31 | 214.2 | 2.93 | 120 | 14 |
Arguments For:
- Dravecky ranks fourth all-time in Padres history in ERA+.
- He ranks 10th in wins.
- In 1984, Dravecky worked 10 2/3 scoreless post-season innings — all in relief, but still.
Arguments Against:
- Dravecky spent much of 1984 and 1987 in the bullpen.
- Dravecky’s best season with the Padres wasn’t that great.
- Only once in his 5 1/2 seasons with the Padres did Dravecky break triple digits in strikeouts — he wasn’t dominant at all.
| Year(s) | GS | IP | ERA | ERA+ | WS | |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| Career with Padres | 1969-1973 | 170 | 1128 | 3.73 | 94 | 49 |
| Best year with Padres | 1971 | 36 | 267.1 | 2.83 | 117 | 17 |
Arguments For:
- Kirby was very tough to hit in 1971; only Chris Young has allowed fewer hits per 9 innings over a Padres season.
- Kirby ranks sixth all-time among Padres in K/9.
- Only Jones and Show have more complete games in a Padres uniform than does Kirby.
Arguments Against:
- Kirby’s ERA+ is subpar.
- Like Dravecky, his best season wasn’t that great.
- Kirby was wild, walking 100+ batters in each of his first four seasons.
Taking only their Padres careers into consideration, which of these pitchers do you like better and why?
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January 30, 2007 at 9:13 am
Gotta go with Dravecky…he also gets bonus points for his story.
January 30, 2007 at 10:16 am
Dravecky … his contributions in 1984 push him ahead …
January 30, 2007 at 12:26 pm
http://blogs.zdnet.com/BTL/?p=4389 … PayPerPost … hmmm … you been contacted yet, GY?
January 30, 2007 at 12:37 pm
Gotta go with Dravecky. He gave solid production, every year. He posted an ERA+ better than 113 four years out of six.
Outside 1971 , Kirby was average at best.
January 30, 2007 at 12:38 pm
LM: I’m aware of this company, but nobody has contacted me.
January 30, 2007 at 1:50 pm
Dravecky gets my nod, both for on and off the field. He spoke at my high school in ‘92 or thereabouts, about his time with the Padres but also about beating his illness and living with one arm. Very engaging, classy fellow.
That said, I’d like to hear what some of the more “experienced” voices have to say about Kirby. I think I’m biased towards the more recent players.
January 30, 2007 at 3:00 pm
Let’s make it unanimous…Dravecky. I think he merits it, but it’s personal, too… one of the most memorable games I’ve ever attended was his comeback game at Candlestick (his last game save for the one that ended horribly). He won the game, threw eight strong (shutting out the Reds for the first seven) to ovations after each inning, Pete Rose got tossed, and I was shivering at a sunny August day game - damn that park was cold.
January 30, 2007 at 3:11 pm
Sounds like Dravecky gets the nod. Just for kicks, Kirby had some unbelievable games with the Padres. Here are three of them:
http://www.baseball-reference......7210.shtml
http://www.baseball-reference......9180.shtml
http://www.baseball-reference......9241.shtml
January 30, 2007 at 4:29 pm
SAN DIEGO (AP) — New Padres manager Bud Black ran into his No. 5 starter on Tuesday at Petco Park and liked what he saw.
http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/ne.....;type=lgns
January 30, 2007 at 5:36 pm
re: 8a … near no-no … heartbreak!
re: 8b … solo-shot to McCovey is all that stood between him an a no-hitter …
re: 8c … 15 innings!!! 15 K’s!!! Dude was a stud in ‘71!
Is the implication that Kirby is above Perry? Props to Clay Kirby!
January 30, 2007 at 7:51 pm
The first post for Peter’s draft coverage:
Scout.com has a top 100 prospects list. I can’t (and wouldn’t anyway) post the whole thing, but here are guys Scout.com rated at the slots the Padres select:
23. James Adkins, LHP Tennessee
44. Nick Noonan, SS, Francis Parker H.S. (San Diego, CA)
56. Drew Cumberland, IF, Pace H.S.
62. Beau Mills, 3B, Lewis-Clark State
63. Brad Chalk, OF, Clemson
83. Mike Stanton, OF, Notre Dame H.S.
89. Daniel Elorriaga-Matra, C, Stoneman Douglas H.S.
119.
133.
149.
If you’re a Scout.com subscriber, check out the link.
http://story.scout.com/a.z?s=3.....p;c=614153
Some other notables I think the Padres are/should be tracking:
#21 Josh Vitters - possibly the top high school hitter in the draft - I doubt he’s available here
#24 Matt Dominguez - another premium high school hitter - this one could be Padre…
#55 Tony Watson - If I remember correctly, this guy was in last year’s draft as an injured player…
#73 Kellen Kulbacki - the numbers he put up as soph are HARD to do on video games (.464/.568/.943), he played in an extreme hitters’ park & against substandard competition - still! - I wouldn’t be surprised to see the Padres pop this guy w/ one of their sandwich picks.
January 30, 2007 at 9:38 pm
OMG, the popular media is finally coming around on the closer issue. Take a look at what Tom Verducci is saying in SI today: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.c.....index.html
January 31, 2007 at 6:59 am
Good to see that the Pads have decided not to trade Linebrink for Aaron “fri’ckn” Roland…please KT, Free Pat the Bat!!
http://www.signonsandiego.com/.....adres.html
Oh yea, Wells is official and Trevor is closing the NYSE today.
January 31, 2007 at 7:11 am
Pat…thanks for that link. I think the highlight is that we cannot forget how lucky we have been to have Trevor closing for us over the past 10+ years. Sustained excellence from a reliever is very rare and this article, while barely mentioning that fact, certainly does a good job of putting Trevor in the hallowed conversation that the media usually reserves for Mariano Rivera. Did you notice his article from last week?
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.c.....index.html
Talking about Buddy Black and why Pitching Coaches should be given more chances to manage…
January 31, 2007 at 7:14 am
I noticed it but didn’t read it. Usually I find Verducci unbearable, but the reliever article caught my eye. So he likes Black?
January 31, 2007 at 7:31 am
15: Once you go Black…….
January 31, 2007 at 7:35 am
re:15…yes…he talks about KT like he is some sort of visionary. Turns into an article about pitchers/pitching coaches needing to get more chances to manage…strange how he does an entire article about that w/o mentioning Tommy Lasorda. Makes me kinda like Verducci a bit more.
Tom…that ain’t right man.
September 9, 2007 at 3:20 am
Kirby wins. Look at the innings he piled up for those dreadful 100 loss per year teams completely devoid of bullpen help. His first year with the Reds, they had a bullpen that could bail him out and he didn’t have to go as long when he started losing his stuff. ERA in ‘74 was a very respectable 3.28. This is more indicative of how good he was in SD. Dravecky was awesome in ‘87 post season but not as a Padre. I’d like to have both on my team.